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chazfort
PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 3:20 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 48
Location: Northern Michigan

Hey all,

I feel like this forum hasn't QUITE lived up to its potential, in that there could be a whole lot of real tutorial material here - simple, easy to follow directions to make certain things happen in PGF. It could be fuel for a user-created manual addendum later on.

For example, there's been a lot of discussion about how to make a melee weapon, but wouldn't it be great to have a simple process list so that newbees (like me) could read the forum, open PGF and make a quick player set all on their own. It would include variable changes and routines, etc.

Here are some tutorials I'd like to see:

1.) melee weapons
2.) mixel's slide/kick combo (and how you get tired doing it)
3.) interesting uses of routines
4.) 10 great ways to kill the player
5.) How to make bosses that rock

...and so on. I understand some of this MIGHT be redundant to other posts, but it would save time and trouble actually trying to track down and figure out what you need.
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FryGuy
PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 5:00 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 101
Location: Cincinnati, OH

Great idea!
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3G Design
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 4:38 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 29 Dec 2005
Posts: 62

When I learn more about PGF I will post some tutorials.
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tushae
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 3:25 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 21 Nov 2005
Posts: 88
Location: Limbo

Im refining something at the moment for my game, could chage the way we make games with PGF Cool
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ecnal
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:21 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 03 Jan 2006
Posts: 103
Location: Vancouver

Care to elaborate?
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tushae
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:13 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 21 Nov 2005
Posts: 88
Location: Limbo

basiclly i fonud a way to make a top down game/ isometric one. but there one more thing i need to work out befor i can use it
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macforme
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:28 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 02 Jan 2006
Posts: 17
Location: SE Wisconsin

That would be sweet! Are you talking a setup like the old Zelda, where you can explore the whole map, do dungeon crawls, and the like? That would be really awesome if it worked. I like the 2D platformer type game, but I REALLY like the Top Down/Isometric, Starcraft type even more.
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ecnal
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:23 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 03 Jan 2006
Posts: 103
Location: Vancouver

Well that's quite a feat to have added the up and down features to movement. I think the Power Games Factory has nowhere to go but up, once more features are implimented it gives designers many more things they can do.

I still think he should check out The Games Factory made by www.clickteam.com on the format for the best game making program that requires no code.
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Mixel
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:31 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 11 Mar 2005
Posts: 932
Location: Leeds, UK

ecnal wrote:
I still think he should check out The Games Factory made by www.clickteam.com on the format for the best game making program that requires no code.


Off topic, but surely multimedia fusion is better? Unfortunately it's much more expensive. Smile And plugging clickteam is all v useful but most of the people here are serious macheads and aren't likely to start using TGF.


As for making tutorials, I agree.. people should.. I don't have much time for it really.. I'll wait until i do something really unusual before writing one.. (err, like setting up isometric levels, lol! Good luck with that tushae - I can imagine that causing all sorts of problems..)
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ecnal
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 7:21 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 03 Jan 2006
Posts: 103
Location: Vancouver

I'm a serious machead myself, I run Multimedia Fusion through Virtual PC, it'd just be great if MAC had a better program for it. Which is why i say there's a lot of features to impliment in order to get a better engine.

I'm not plugging tgf , rather pointing out little things that could truely make PGF the best out there.
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tushae
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:31 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 21 Nov 2005
Posts: 88
Location: Limbo

macforme wrote:
That would be sweet! Are you talking a setup like the old Zelda, where you can explore the whole map, do dungeon crawls, and the like? That would be really awesome if it worked. I like the 2D platformer type game, but I REALLY like the Top Down/Isometric, Starcraft type even more.


Thats what im working on .. but its literally one last thing i need to work out.

Confused
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chazfort
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:43 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 48
Location: Northern Michigan

Quote:
As for making tutorials, I agree.. people should.. I don't have much time for it really.. I'll wait until i do something really unusual before writing one..


How about someting simpler - remember that MOST of us are still novices with PGF. I think it could be as easy as using Grab to take screenshots of say, projectile settings, or player settings etc.

Perhaps that's too much of an invasion of privacy/intellectual domain of someone's hard work, but I think we'll ALL benefit from a wider and more expansive exchange.

There was talk about making a boomerang - I'd love to see the settings to make it work! Same with melee attacks, the bouncing lizard-boss rock-vomit Smile and on and on and on.
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Mixel
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 6:45 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 11 Mar 2005
Posts: 932
Location: Leeds, UK

Sorry ecnal I wasn't meaning to be rude.. TGF and MMF are great products.. I'm not sure everyone would like to see PGF develop in that sort of direction..

Chazfort - I see what you're getting at.. It's just there are so many properties and things that I suspect the sharing of ideas will only really kick off once the content manager thing is added.. It's a hassle writing out tutorials otherwise.. All the things in ZH (apart from the bits where I've asked on the board) I worked out with trial and error.. I haven't completed a single level yet, so I still think myself a novice really.

Tushae; Is there any way other people can help you work it out?
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ecnal
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:48 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 03 Jan 2006
Posts: 103
Location: Vancouver

Mixel - Perhaps not become those programs (MMF or TGF) but impliment a lot of their more advanced features.

I know from experience working with MMF is kinda like having a blank slate and the possibilities are almost endless. Where PGF feels more like a pre-made game (Greenland Invasion) and we're filling in the graphics with our own work.
Not to discredit it as an amazing achievement ( especially considering it was made by one guy! ), I'd just like to see it become more customizable.
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obleo
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 1:57 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 662
Location: Chicago

If you can not make a game with PGF customized to your own game, You most not be trying to hard.
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Mixel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 3:51 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 11 Mar 2005
Posts: 932
Location: Leeds, UK

ecnal wrote:
I know from experience working with MMF is kinda like having a blank slate and the possibilities are almost endless. Where PGF feels more like a pre-made game (Greenland Invasion) and we're filling in the graphics with our own work.

Hmm, if nothing else that's a good reason for Jesse to implement the "start new blank project" idea.. So people don't think of it like the "Greenland construction set", hehe.

I do see what you're getting at... I've made stuff in TGF too.. But it's near impossible to make it as smooth as the stuff PGF makes.. I like to think of PGF more like a (pretty darn flexible) engine.. You wouldn't say everything using the Quake engine was the same but with different graphics. Once you start playing with the properties and variables PGF can make something that's absolutely nothing like greenland invasion. IE; is Mario the same as Turrican the same as Castlevania?

People have barely scratched what pgf is capable of already.. Smile And Jesse's always adding new features.. Hmm.. If he ever manages to implement the drawn enemy/weapon paths one then PGF will be so much more multifunction it'd be scary.

Wow sorry chaz.. TOTALLY off topic here.
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ecnal
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:54 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 03 Jan 2006
Posts: 103
Location: Vancouver

I double the apology, although I think it's a great discussion so I hope you don't mind.

Mixel - You make a very good point with the Quake engine. Although I'm sure you're aware that the Quake engine is more then a graphics generator. The possibilities are quite endless within the confines of its max specifications.

And since you brought up retro games, I find it interesting you're comparing the likes of Mario to Castlevania. You should be comparing Castlevania to Contra, because both are weapon based action titles.

The best thing to take from your last post tho, is certainly how smooth PGF is. That's something that puts it in serious contention with any other 2D GUI Game Maker. It runs perfectly like an original 16-bit Neogeo game.
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obleo
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:24 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 662
Location: Chicago

ecnal wrote:
Mario ( even if it was Super Mario Brothers 1 ) games have the changing size/form at the centre of the gameplay, which unfortunately you can't do in PGF.


Have you looked passed the default settings, because you can make these type of games. This is the type of game I am working on. yes one that does not have weapons.

To change sizes like those in the old mario type games add routines to change the player types. Really not so hard.

By default it looks like just an weapon game (because it uses the greenland invasion as a template to start), creative look at the goals you want to accomplish, their are ways to make them work. I am not using blocks , but I figure out ways that blocks could work.

I sat down with PGF from June to August making little two level games of many different types to see what could be done. And it is more than just an weapon based engine if you look outside the box. Does PGF have room to grow?, why yes.

I would agree which some of the click team things you talk about, My cousin uses their products and he made some cool games, Wish they had an OS X version, or maybe some day I will break down and get a PC.

I learn much from seeing Mixel's project and what he set up with projectiles. That is a great example of thinking outside the box, to make a game type work. Specially one that most people wrote off that you could not do with PGF.
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Angel_Fires
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:37 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 754
Location: St. Paul, MN

I think that this thread is really... wrong. I mean if people should write tutorials, write tutorials!!! Don't complain about how there should be more, just make some! The reason there isn't a tutorial for everything is because there's a MANUAL! YOu read it, and you know what to do. I think of the tutorials as being there for advanced users who understand PGF and want to use kooler things not pointed out in the manual.
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chazfort
PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 12:25 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 48
Location: Northern Michigan

There's a huge difference, in my mind, between tutorials and a manual. Manuals say, "Onion - can be sliced or chopped or minced. Beware of fumes - they make you cry. Sauteeing turns them soft and delicious. Carmelizing... etc"

On the other hand, Tutorials teach you how to make French Onion soup - step 1, step 2, etc

Simlarly, the photoshop and pgf manuals describe what every tool can do, what every check box is for, etc. but (for example) don't tell you how to create a melee weapon or hide secret levels in the main level. Most of us have learned how to do those things through expirimentation or by dedicated reading of these forums.

Every manual I've ever read shows the need for improvement, and PGF is no exception. When I use photoshop there are thousands of tutorials on the web that I can read to show me a cool trick or how to use a tool differently, etc. They help make photoshop a very popular program. How sweet would it be if every new PGF user, confronted with the snowmen and snowmobile on startup, had twenty or thirty tutorials ready to go that walked them through some very cool and flexible processes to show them what PGF was capable of.

Thats all.

Quote:
I think that this thread is really... wrong.


I mean, if people should not read threads, don't read threads!!! Don't complain about how wrong the thread is, just don't read it!
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Badone
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2006 10:43 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Jun 2006
Posts: 110
Location: Canada

it's easy to make up down movement, you only have to make your player fly so t dont fall when he stop going upward. Then had movement where the character walk up instead of jumping animation and character walk down instead of descending animation. I found that in my zelda game but it was too late to make the whole game around this feature, so it's only a small part of the game and it is not implemented very well. Hopefully i will make another zelda game that is 100% top down movement.
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Badone
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2006 10:43 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Jun 2006
Posts: 110
Location: Canada

it's easy to make up down movement, you only have to make your player fly so t dont fall when he stop going upward. Then had movement where the character walk up instead of jumping animation and character walk down instead of descending animation. I found that in my zelda game but it was too late to make the whole game around this feature, so it's only a small part of the game and it is not implemented very well. Hopefully i will make another zelda game that is 100% top down movement.
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Badone
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2006 10:43 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Jun 2006
Posts: 110
Location: Canada

oouppsss double post sorry!
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Badone
PostPosted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 2:01 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 04 Jun 2006
Posts: 110
Location: Canada

Well my method for up down movement was a total failure... Tushae, what about yours? I am trying to make a zelda game and i am just wasting my time trying to figure out how to make isometric movement...
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atomicenergy
PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 11:41 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 27 Sep 2009
Posts: 69
Location: Canada, Québec

Badone wrote:
Well my method for up down movement was a total failure... Tushae, what about yours? I am trying to make a zelda game and i am just wasting my time trying to figure out how to make isometric movement...

Well the only way i see right now is to make the player fly every time, in the animations, when he look up it can be when he's walking upward and the same for the down. Try it out, if you don't even try it. Razz
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